Kim Brennan has been a commercial real estate broker for more than 30 years. By her
count, women made up about 5% of brokers when she started.
She figures it’s about the same now.
“It’s been easier for women to come into the industry,” she said. “I’m not so sure women
have stayed in the industry once they’ve come in.”
Brennan, a Managing Director and office broker at Cushman & Wakefield, talked about
it Thursday at Real Estate Rush, an event for women in commercial real estate at
Basking Ridge Country Club.
Brennan says the industry is more inviting and welcoming to women than when she
started, but that hasn’t resulted in more women getting involved.
“I still feel like we have women that fall off,” she said. “The number is almost flat. I don’t
believe it’s really gone up.”
***
Brennan isn’t sure why women leave. Starting a family may be part of it, she said,
though the business is easier on mothers than it used to be.
“I don’t even remember taking a maternity leave,” she said. “I was on calls in the
hospital.”
She even said there are enough opportunities for women to move up — just not enough
women looking to do so. Many women in the industry hold salaried jobs, she said, while
brokerage is commission-only.
“Maybe that’s daunting to them,” she said.
So where should the number be? Brennan didn’t hesitate: “It should be 25% to 50%,”
she said. “There should be way more women doing this.”
***
Jackie Chesler, a Vice Chair at Colliers who handles investment sales, said it’s no
different in her corner of the business.
“I can just tell you, on the investment sales side, we just don’t see a lot of women,” she
said.
It could be the finance backgrounds the work calls for, she said, or the hours, or trying
to balance children and childcare. It still puzzles her.
“I don’t really get it or understand it personally, because it is a phenomenal industry to
be part of,” she said.
Chesler said the pay problem isn’t only a women’s problem. She is trying to hire two
sales associates, and she said commission scares off men, too. It can take a year or
two to get your footing, and new hires have health insurance and student loans to pay.
So Chesler said her team is looking at a hybrid: a salary plus a bonus plus potential
commission. The idea is to give new brokers time to learn the craft, she said, so they
don’t quit after six or nine months.
“If you can sustain in this business as a broker — and I’m not talking one or two years,
I’m talking a number of years — and you build your relationships, you’re golden,” she
said. “But it takes a lot of time. It’s about sustainability.”
Chesler and Brennan both said it takes 3-5 years to really find your footing.
***
Marta Villa, a Senior Vice President at CBRE and the founder of Real Estate Rush, said
it’s even tougher in retail.
“It’s very hard to be a broker in retail,” she said.
But retail has its own math. Deals are smaller, so it’s a volume business. Brokers often
split the fee — 2½% and 2½% — while in industrial and office, the procuring broker or
tenant rep often gets the full 5%.
And retail brokers wait for their money.
“If I do a deal today, I’ll get paid in eight months or 12 months from now,” she said. “The
first of three or four payments, right, and that happens over time.”
If the tenant defaults before the last payment comes in, the broker doesn’t get it.
“There’s a lot more risk in what I do,” she said.
Villa sees the struggle up close. She mentioned a woman who works with her, is great
at the job but wants a salary.
“She has an apartment,” Villa said. “She needs a paycheck.”
Villa put the climb at about three years before the money starts coming, and five before
it’s steady.
***
Brennan said it’s not all about the money, it’s about reaching woman at a younger age
to explain the sector.
“It should start in high school,” she said.
The industry has to do a better job of communicating what the job is — and what it isn’t.
“There’s times now where I tell people I’m in commercial real estate, and they’ll say, ‘Oh, I have a friend that just sold a house,’” she said.
College programs are helping, Brennan said, pointing to Rutgers and Monmouth
University.
Ron Ladell, a Senior Vice President at Vivmark Residential and chair of the executive
committee of the Rutgers Center for Real Estate, said the potential is now. Right now,
Ladell estimates about 42% of his students are women. His goal is 50%.
He uses pros like Villa to help. When she guest lectures in his class, Ladell says a
handful of women always come up to talk to her afterward.
“That’s the idea,” he said.
So, the pipeline is there. It’ just a matter of finding a way to keep it growing, to move
that 5% figure into double-digits. And that’s just a start.
“This is a great job and a great career,” Chesler said. “I encourage more women to join.”
